Who’s fault is it?
If a woman wears immodest clothing, and it results in a man lusting after her, who’s fault is it, the woman or the man? 27 Comments » |
If a woman wears immodest clothing, and it results in a man lusting after her, who’s fault is it, the woman or the man? 27 Comments » |
Comment by Leah
Both. She set up the temptation and he chose to allow himself to think about her inappropriately.
Comment by Anonymous
The answer to this is like saying that’s the world’s fault that i fell into porn, conformity, adultery, etc. You have got to be on guard. Yes, the woman has played a part in the man’s lusting, but the man is accountable.
Comment by Joselyn Rushton
The answer to this is like saying that’s the world’s fault that i fell into porn, conformity, adultery, etc. You have got to be on guard. Yes, the woman has played a part in the man’s lusting, but the man is accountable.
Comment by Marcus
If a lady wears immodest clothing, she has the Lord to answer to for that. However, if it results in a man lusting after her, the man has the Lord to answer to for lusting.
If a man was to walk down the red-light district in town, there will be plenty of prostitutes seducing him with their eyes, bodies and clothes. But just because the man is in a situation that will naturally allow him to lust in his fleshy nature, DOES NOT MEAN that the man has no choice but to lust. Following that, the man actually has a choice of whether he wants to sin or not.
So it is the man’s fault for lusting.
Comment by Chris
They are both at fault. The man is at fault for lusting and the woman is at fault for causing a stumbling block in front of the man. Sin is sin
Comment by Mr. H
I won’t quote Bible Verses because everyone should already be well known to which ones “fall” under this category. I have had many discussions with people (especially females) who profess the name of the Lord Jesus, but just don’t care how they dress, about this subject.
They don’t care if they show the shape of their body, how much skin they show, nor what other people think about that. It’s all about what makes them feel good, what makes them look better than the other person. I always wonder if they feel that the world would value them more as a person depending on how much skin (or body parts) are shown.
If you bring it to their attention, they get defensive and they stick to the “their Perverts and they shouldn’t look at me in that way” line. And also, “The Lord sees our heart, not our appearance”, “I need to look cute for my husband and not cover myself up from head to toe or else he is going to leave me for another attractive woman”.
They always, and I mean always, justify their clothing style no matter how revealing their clothes is or what the Bible says about it.
We as men, and some more than others, struggle with our eyes just wandering all over the place, especially when a female is involved. By nature, that’s who we are! Women sometimes don’t understand that and that’s why they don’t care and call men perverts. But they just don’t see the damage they are causing for all men out there.
I’m also not saying that you women need to wear a super long blanket over you and only have your eyes showing… so don’t get it all twisted. Their is ALWAYS a modest and decent way to dress “Cute” and “Stay in Style” without being revealing or inappropriate.
Just think of it this way, “will I be okay standing right in front of our Lord dressed this way?”
Because of today’s Fashion and Hollywood Entertainment world, women want to dress with the latest fashions and it don’t matter how much of their body shows. Which is wrong.
So to answer the question without anymore of my two cents, it’s the women’s fault IF they dress with immodest clothing!
Comment by Ethan
Both are accountable!
The girl is accountable for making Him stumble by casting a stumbling block.
1 Corinthians 8:9-10 “Be careful, however, that the exercise of your rights does not become a stumbling block to the weak. For if someone with a weak conscience sees you, with all your knowledge, eating in an idol’s temple, won’t that person be emboldened to eat what is sacrificed to idols?”
And the Guy is accountable for what He thought, breaking the 7th Commandment.
Matthew 5:28 “But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.”
Comment by curtis
Maybe both…To me you should only worry about your sin unless ,the woman causing people lust is your daughter or wife. In my opinion it is not lust to look at beauty but it is when your mind goes to far with that beauty, just simply enjoying beautiful women is natural and God intended for us to…just be careful
Comment by Dave
As I read these posts, so many verses come to mind.
“Let he who is without sin cast the first stone”.
“Do not attempt to remove the splinter from your Brother’s eye until you have removed the log from yours”.
“Judge not, Lest ye be judged”.
As Christians, we should not be determining who is at fault.
Comment by Mimi
I truly feel that the woman is at fault. I believe that she is dressing in an immodest manner, so that men will lust over her. I believe she is looking to gratify herself through the attention of men. BUT it is up to the man to look away (realize that this is a temptation, through no fault of theirs) and pray himself out of what he may be feeling.
Psalm 119:9-10 ESV
How can a young man keep his way pure? By guarding it according to your word. With my whole heart I seek you; let me not wander from your commandments!
Comment by Edith Jane
I’d say both… when Jesus was being tempted by satan, He was still strong enough to say NO even when He was 40 days hungry and was teased with bread. A woman dressed in such a way is being the tempter and the man was weak enough to fall for it.
Everyday we’re faced with the Adam and Eve temptation, and everyday we fail… Thank God He died and saved us!!! JESUS IS LORD
Comment by Michael James Stone
Who’s fault is it?
If a woman wears immodest clothing, and it results in a man lusting after her, who’s fault is it, the woman or the man?
(interesting this isn’t asked in the Normal Format)
This is a Fallacy question:
1) A woman dresses immodestly
>Fallacy is there is no criteria stated for modesty.
2) Man lusting after her
>Fallacies are “implied” by the dress
>It actually can be a Man who lusts after her no matter what she wears.
Whose fault is it?
>Fallacy is there is only ONE action stated, the man and lust.
It’s what we call a logic bomb. There is no actual fact based answer because it a Vagary disguised as a specific.
See:http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Clear_Thinking/Informal_Fallacies/Introduction/introduction.html
For an exact definition.
But lets play with the scriptures the premise is trying to create the scenario the person wants.
Are you accountable to the actions of another’s reactions?
The “dress” of the person is not a scriptural issue, or, it is a relationship development aspect that a person who has issue with the persons dress is required to seek “settlement” for peace sake if both parties are in the same faith etc.
A man lusting after a woman is not “invoked” by dress. It is a process development of Thought, Consideration, Decision making, and Participation All on the mans “actions” and “intentions”.
If a man is tempted, then he knows it is not the source that is the issue, but the response to temptation in which he decides to “reject” the initial “contact” of the temptation in thought by sight or external stimulus.
If he chooses to “participate” in the temptation, he creates in himself the opportunity for sin. He “indulges” in the process of development of self-discipline by either responding in a scriptural/spiritual/godly manner, or “heeding” and yielding his member (his mind) to the provocation.
If he did not, it would be a growth process.
Since the person who is viewing the “immodesty” is determining the modesty or immodesty and response, it isn’t the clothes that make a circumstance one way or the other.
The same scenario would be less dramatic if you said: A Doctor noticed a woman who was dressed immodestly came to him for a Full Pelvic exam. The fact I didn’t say Gynecologist would also make what looks like “sin of the womans choice of clothes” above proof that this is a Bad question and used in logic classes as a Prime example of fallacy because Scripture is absolute, so your answers have to include any exceptions……
Comment by Marcus
In your post Mr H., you mentioned that ‘By nature, that’s who we are!’
God did not call upon us to lust. That is an excuse which will by every means give guys the chance to say “Oh well, it’s not my fault that I’m lusting (sinning)”
Comment by Kuya
I’m a girl, and I agree with “Mr. H”
Comment by Dave
Luke 17:1 Things that cause people to sin are bound to come, but woe to that person through whom they come.
Doesn’t get to the matter of the question but sheds new light on it.
I agree w/Michael James Stone, too many variables to be answered directly.
Comment by R
Christian women(and young teenage girls) should not wear immodest attire (this includes bikinis and too revealing one piece swimsuits), in the first place, no matter what the world is telling them. The man see it look away, like what Joesph did when Potiphar wife tried to seduce him , RUN from it.
If does happen they fall both are at fault.
Comment by ceseeley
All;
Some people scientist say that women are relationship oriented and romantically stimulated; while men are goal oriented and visually stimulated!!! If this is true, who is taking advantage of who; who is the weaker one in this situation; who is more vulnerable???
If this is all that one has to live by, they could both be targets and/or predators of each other.
Thank God for the liberating Power of the Gospel, the Holy Spirit and Thy Holy Word … Praise God!!!
Comment by Scott
Mr H, Mimi, and Kuya are the only correct answerers. Michael James Stone has serious issues with his convictions and Dave, you just avoided the question altogether. It all comes down to what the first sin was. Just like in the case of Adam and Eve and the old joke of what came first, the chicken or the egg. Eve is deceived by the serpent and gives to her husband. If Eve is not deceived, neither would have been Adam. From creation, we know that God created man first so it was also the chicken that came before the egg.
And in this example of the modesty of dress, if the woman dresses modestly, she does not give her unspoken permission to be lusted after. Once the woman sinned, the man sinned.
So, as for who is the one who caused the lusting…it was the woman. God called women the weaker sex and called for them to dress modestly knowing that the weakness of men would be tempted. Why would any good Christian woman want to cause another to stumble. Vanity and selfishness. Solomon warned us about vanity as it is like chasing after the wind and selfishness is the basis for all sin. Take the first letter of each syllable of the word self-ish-ness and what to you get…..SIN!
Why did God warn us about spouses withholding sex so as to possibly cause the other to stray. The blame was put on the one withholding, not the one that strayed, although the straying would also be a sin.
God speaks often about not doing things that would cause another to stumble. You would not take an alcoholic friend to a bar or enjoy a drink at home in his presence. You should not be glutenous in front of someone struggling with issues of weight. You should not gossip with someone who struggles with gossip, just as you should not eat meat offered to idols so that someone who struggles with that in your presence would be tempted by their weakness. That example cover most of these real world examples.
Sorry, ladies, if you dress like a harlot, you cause men who are weak to struggle and you are the first sinner. Of course there are men who will lust no matter what you are wearing and they just could be the husband for you who sees beauty and desire in a smile and in your grace. Or they are just a sinner.
Comment by jeremy
Just a quick comment. IF a dollar is sitting on a counter and you take it is it the dollars fault? A sin is a sin no mattere if it be lust or stealing. That being said I believe its the mans fault. May GOD bless you all.
Comment by Mimi
Scott & All,
I love it when people say it the way it is. Your comments were dead on. Especially “if the woman dresses modestly, she does not give her unspoken permission to be lusted after.” Woman who dress immodestly are giving their permission to have a man lust for them, in fact that is exactly what they are trying to encourage. I dress modestly, but I dress feminine, I want to feel like a woman, I want to be appreciated and treated like a lady, not as an object. I dress for myself, I like to match my accessories with my outfit and my lipstick with what I am wearing, I feel good being a lady. I don’t want men seeing me as a boy toy. I want to be seen as valuable and as a person with a mind as a Woman of God. So I dress accordingly. (Hahaha, I am laughing to myself, I use to go to a Woman’s Bible Study and there were such beautiful Christian ladies there…they all looked lovely and many wore necklaces, earrings and lipstick, just what I love to wear so, I would find myself looking around at the other ladies and thinking “Oh doesn’t she look nice”…when I should of been listening to the Lecture, whew I feel better with that confession off my chest, lol.) But truthfully woman who wear immodest clothing, are doing so on purpose, they know exactly the reaction they will get from a man. I use to be a cashier and I dealt with hundreds of people. Let me say that I had more than a few woman come through my line that were dressed so immodestly that I was staring at them and had to pull my eyes away from the. Part of it is a shock factor, you don’t expect to see a black bra under a sheer pink top, or a woman’s breasts literally pushed up out of her top, I could go on but I will stop. . The surprise of the unexpected, what isn’t the norm will almost shock you in a way, I know it did me and as a woman I had to force myself to look the other way. I can’t imagine how a man would feel. So it does fall on the woman and it is up to the man to look away and not be tempted any further by what he has already seen.
Amen amen amen to this statement!!!”Why did God warn us about spouses withholding sex so as to possibly cause the other to stray. The blame was put on the one withholding, not the one that strayed, although the straying would also be a sin.” There are many good Christian articles that can help couples address their sex life. I think it is a shame that the Church isn’t teaching us about sex. Couples would benefit much more if it did. here is a good article….
http://www.kyria.com/topics/marriagefamily/marriage/romancesex/4.34.html
http://www.crosswalk.com/marriage/11532504/
There are a lot of good websites if you google Sex & Christian Marriage.
Comment by Richard Broch
Greetings Brothers and Sisters,
Scriptures pertaining to this matter:
1 Timothy 2:9,”Likewise, I want women to adorn themselves with proper clothing, with MODESTY and DISCREETLY,……….”
Now, I don`t need to disect those words, or throw any kind of “logic bomb” into the game to understand what the Word of God is saying here.
1 Corinthians 5:12-13,”For what do I have to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church? (13)But, those who are outside, God judges. Remove the wicked man from among yourselves.”
Here we are reminded to judge other Christians`behavior. And God will judge the rest of the world.
John7:24,(in red letters),”Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgement.”
Jesus is telling us it`s o.k. to judge daily routine matters in our lives, but do it according to His precepts. Plus we are not to make eternal condemnations on anyone.
I think the woman and man are both guilty.
If they would use the useless excuse – “The devil made me do it”, it would`nt stand in God`s court for a minute.
Grace and Peace.
Comment by alvin
Matthew 5:28 if a man looks at a woman with lust in his heart….the greek word for woman is gune- specifically a married woman. the emphasis of the verse is that once you know she is not available for marriage, put a big ‘not for me’ sign in the brain.
-i am acqainted with females so beautiful that there is no way they could be any less beautiful no matter how conservative they dress.
-would someone like to point out the difference between attraction and lust?
-why do many of these posts assume that lust is only a male attribute? that definitely does not fit the facts! and provocative does not apply only to clothing, but to every other purposeful look or action that one person can aim at another.
-if a female dresses to ‘tease the animals’ that is premeditated.
-if a female dresses like hollywood or tv in innocence, there is an IQ level problem.
-if a christian female fits in the above two categories, there is a sin problem (might as well aplly this to men as well).
-the social scientists who say women are not visually stimulated are wrong, though that effect is stronger in the average male. there are male dancers…..
-if a man looks and recognizes lust in his heart, he needs to follow Gods’ advice to Cain, “if you do not well, sin crouches at the door”(genesis 4)
-enticement may be purposeful and sinful, but is no excuse for the recipient of the suggestion to fall for it.
Comment by Mimi
Ceseeley & All,
I disagree with your statement. The woman in this situation is not the weaker one, she knows exactly what she is doing. The weaker one is the man, who she knows is stimulated visually & so she is purposely trying to make him stumble. He can’t help what may cross his eyes, but he can turn and look away. If I caused you to stumble would you say that it is your fault when it is really mine???
Comment by Malik
I honestly am torn on this issue and it makes me feel bad for women. Heres my opinion. If seeing someones calfs or their arms makes you lust after them, then its just that persons fault for being a pervert.
Comment by Debbie
Scott,
What did God create first, the chicken or the egg? Correct Answer: Chicken.
MARANATHA
Comment by windyblue
Always the woman’s fault. She shows cleavage and gets called a ****
Now, the man needs to put his eye’s back in his head. And learn to control themselves. And they cannot. Woman get blamed for it all.
Lets look at a man, who walks around in a public place with no shirt on, or muscle shirts, I was at a picnic once, it was a church members home, and a few of the men where walking around with there shirts off, I wanted to vomit. I just prayed to the Lord about them.
I did not stay long either. Men need to put there eyes back in there heads. Yes I call them perverts too.
WE do not live in Biblical times anymore, where woman and even in Iran, Iraq, and more places over sea’s woman have to cover every part of there bodies, nothing can show. Not even there faces.
And they get beat, killed, sold, the man can do what ever he wants to her and get away with it.
Just like in biblical times. it makes me vomit.
I live in the USA, and thank God for that everyday I was born here.
I can dress the way I want. NO I am not dressing like a lady of the evening.
Comment by Mimi
Malik and All,
Woman who dress provocatively are doing it for the attention, nothing to feel sorry about, they are getting what they are after, men’s attention. Feel bad for the men that the woman helps to stumble.
I got a kick out of the rest of your comment “If seeing someones calfs or their arms makes you lust after them, then its just that persons fault for being a pervert.” Hahaha!
Comment by Michael James Stone
Hmm Scott,
Hope you aren’t getting personal.
Let see, if a Man goes to the beach is he responsible for ALL the WOMEN who dressed immodestly.
Errr lers see if a woman wear a swimsuit is she immodest?
The variables Scott are called Situational Ethics and while I appreciate your assessment (grin) unless the circumstances are defined your exceptions will negate your absolutes.
THAT is why we have a Holy Spirit and a personal relationship because one mans Orthodoxy is another mans liberality.
While I appreciate Scott for perspective and his ability to exercise it, I must say, I am glad that the Body of Christ is diverse with many members and God alone can sort that one out.
Me? I am going to the beach……….