Comment by Michael James Stone
Well, the “temple” of a persons body was in jeopardy with Lot and God didn’t send the Angels in to overthrow the regimes of the Kings of Sodom, but after Abraham interceded, saved Lot.
(maybe we should intercede like Abraham)
The Temple of God in Israel was technically the “house of God” and the zeal of the Lord was enough to drive out moneychangers, but not overthrow the ruling religious class that sanctioned it.
The Son of God was “big enough” and important enough that Jesus himself said to Pilate you don’t have Authority EXCEPT THAT GOD GAVE IT TO YOU…., and if it was matter of power, I could be free in a heartbeat, I can just say God help me and God would send angels to wipe out….
The First, Second, and Third Century church is describes as LAW ABIDING and NON COMBATIVE focused on an unseen kingdom.
Only the “Militant” church, when combined with political agendas as in a large part of the Catholic structure, did “overthrowing anything come into play and that led to “Inquistions” “Crusades” Pogroms and a real distaste by some for anything Christian.
BUT I agree with my learned Grandpa poster above:
It is obvious what Jesus said, it is also what what people do. If you are a modern Fundy GUNDY lets run for office if Jesus Name kinda guy, or God give me the ability the KIll my Enemies for you Jesus, then Yes, as most will do, they will reject the fact that two old men can see the facts from the fallacies and sure enough as I am writing this “invent” an interpretation that fits what they want to do.
Or DUCK the issue and make it a discussion on an off topic.
The problem is everyone is willing to be abundantly Blessed to be a Christian, perfectly content to “Live for Jesus as they see fit and given God the Glory….,
But how many are willing to suffer, and die, and put up with this statement:
Matthew 5:43-48 (King James Version)
43Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
44But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
45That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
46For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
47And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
48Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
Oh yeah, that means it’s an allegory, or an idea or a “theme” except that the end of the conversation He warned about those who would and would NOT DO these sayings of His.
Yes, there is every excuse for action and revolt, but very little room for a Christian to Trust in the Lord with all their heart, Leaning not into their own understanding, In all their ways acknowledging Him AND HE DIRECTING YOUR PATH.
The impersonal are recognized by the personal or impersonal response.
Just How personal is your God and what is He telling you to do. If it is to overthrow a government in “some cases” then YOUR GOD is a like all the other gods of men with the same results at their gods.
But as for me, and My Lord, before He came I would have taken up a sword, before He spoke I would have waked a righteous cause, but since he came, and since he spoke and since he directs to me today…No I won’t be overthrowing any governments by obvious means.
Because I care, i will take it to Prayer and leave it there.
Comment by alvin
Romans 13: 3 “rulers are not a terror to good works”.
is this a scriptural definition of a ruler? If a ruler does not fulfill this quality, have they given up their right to rule?
(i am going to stick to questions this time.)
v. 1 states that “the powers that exist are ordained of God”
Daniel 5 reveals the divine handwriting of judgement to an evil king of his day, and the chapter ends, “in that night Belshazzar the king of the Chaldeans was slain, and Darius the Mede took the kingdom, who was about 62 years old.”
are we too quick to force a neccessary turn over of power?
are we too unbelieving in the power of prayer alone?
i was just musing a week ago on what the usa would be like today, if the north had let the south separate instead of fighting the civil war? too many variables to really know aren’t there?
then i remembered that the south militarily attacked the north first, and almost took the nations capitol early in that war.
in the current egypt situation, is the president of egypt the worst leader who has ever held office? are his possible replacements going to be better or worse?
And is the egyptian decision primarily up to egypt, and not leaders of other countries? God did say in Habakkuk 1:6 “i raise up the bitter and hasty Chaldean nation, which shall march through the breadth of the land to possess dwellingplaces not their own.”( as judgment to Israel at that time)?
what is the responsibility of powerful nations in the affairs of weaker nations? do we have a right to tell others how to run their lives?
on the other side, do we have a moral responsibility to help any country where we have opportunity to bring change and encourage a good end result?
i think those who teach peace are often right, but i wonder when they are, and when they are not….
us americans, are we too proud?
